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| rip stop guitar sides http://www-.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=48854 |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Sat Jan 14, 2017 10:21 am ] |
| Post subject: | rip stop guitar sides |
For those of us who do "double sides" and laminated sides, has anyone considered using drywall fibreglass mesh interleaved between the veneers rather than side reinforcements (tapes or veneer) on the inside of the guitar? I have used graphite cloth between veneers, but it is a little bit expensive and hard on the tooling. This product looks like it might be an interesting alternative: http://duckbrand.com/products/paint-diy ... in-x-25-ft Google says it's available at Walmart. Any thoughts on how it might work out? |
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| Author: | Alex Kleon [ Sat Jan 14, 2017 10:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: rip stop guitar sides |
I've used it for drywall repairs - sticky on one side, and the weaves tend to separate a bit if you aren't careful. It's a fair bit thicker than regular drywall paper tape. Bob Shanklin told me that he used silk cloth for a double top, and that it came out super stiff. Alex |
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| Author: | wbergman [ Sat Jan 14, 2017 11:22 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: rip stop guitar sides |
The laminated sides I did had a veneer cross grain to the main wood. These were only two layers -- main wood on the outside and cross grain thin veneer on the inside. They did not buckle, which I worried from the cross grain orientation. Has anyone who laminates sides with all the grain running the long way even had cracks later? |
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| Author: | Toonces [ Sat Jan 14, 2017 11:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: rip stop guitar sides |
There are many ways to improve construction on a guitar but very few of those things lead to a better guitar/product. If you are willing to sink hundreds upon hundreds of hours into a single guitar then you can approach things differently but as a pro builder, I try to balance my time and put additional effort where it makes the most impact. I see a lot of posts trying to rethink various aspects of guitar construction. This is a good thing but I would advise to temper with two important points: 1) Noticeable departure from tradition is generally not accepted by the guitar playing community, especially for high-end instruments. Double sides are great but when you start using drywall mesh in your instruments, lots of folks will just walk past your guitars without ever playing them. The same thing can apply to carbon fiber and radical bracing techniques. Just something to think about 2) Figure out when good enough is good enough. This is a personal line everyone must draw. For me, double sides are advantageous over single sides. They are a traditional building approach and they offer excellent stability. If a person drops a guitar hard, you will likely have some serious damage even if using mesh in your sides -- so I don't build for prevention of major accidents but rather everyday, normal usage of my instruments. My personal answer to your question is not to use mesh. I use a relatively thin outer laminate (0.050") and an inner laminate of Port Orford Cedar (0.100"). For the inner laminate I would recommend you use an extremely stable wood. Doing so, IMO, yields a plenty stable product and one that looks attractive and harkens to traditional methods of building. |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Sat Jan 14, 2017 12:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: rip stop guitar sides |
"Has anyone who laminates sides with all the grain running the long way even had cracks later?" I laminate backs and sides using sequence matched veneers glued together in the same order they were cut (usually 3 - 4 pieces). Although I have never had sides split, on a couple of occasions when the instruments were subjected to extreme low humidity I have had the back crack, just as a solid wood instrument would. I don't know if mesh would make any difference in that situation. I have seen some solid wood guitars with long splits in the sides from being dropped. I'm thinking mesh might help limit damage in that situation, and placed between double sides would not be an obvious part of the construction. This would preserve a traditional look which many people (myself included) find desirable. Have others done it and would it be worth doing? I don't know, that's why I'm asking. It's something I - might - try in the future. |
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| Author: | wbergman [ Sat Jan 14, 2017 4:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: rip stop guitar sides |
Perhaps if you are doing three or four laminations, run one cross grain. The cross grain one you do not even need to prebend. I am not experienced with mesh, but it seems to me that cross grain wood would be as strong as needed. I am just guessing, but the mesh would require a lot of glue to fill the voids. |
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